Discussion in 'The Country Club' started by jmane, Dec 25, 2014.

  1. jmane

    jmane New Member

    Why did I purchase a home in the country club years ago and thus pay extra for my lot? Gates (which I thought were for private roads at the time), security, and an association that would maintain the appearance of same. I'm very opposed to giving vendors transponders. Instead, let's have a gate just for them that is maintained by a live person/camera, etc., or whatever it takes to secure our homes! Just because our roads are public, doesn't mean we have to open our gates to vendors. That's a double negative. There have been an increased number of robberies in the CC and enough is enough. Question: As residents, why don't we have any say so in these situations?
  2. Bob Bronston

    Bob Bronston Founding Member

    I understand that SMR was caught off guard a while back when they realized that CC roads were public and could not be restricted. This is why they made CCE private, as I've heard the story.
    However, as long as the roads are open to the public (because the public pays for them) no one should be denied access, vendor or not. Personally, I don't even think there should be gates or that people should be stopped and questioned. That must be unconstitutional at some level.
  3. Steve Metcalf

    Steve Metcalf Super-Star Member

    I said I'm against it in the thread below this so now I'm repeating myself. But it seems to me it's a baby step towards making the CC more open. They really can't deny access. If you go to the gate and say "let me in" and nothing else they have to. It's really a shame that RE agents aren't upfront with the public road information when selling a house. As far as how do we find out about the agenda before it's voted on...I have no clue. I suppose go to the CCD meetings? I don't even know when or where they are held.
  4. Bob Bronston

    Bob Bronston Founding Member

    First, you are assuming that all agents know or should know about this issue. My guess is that many in LWR don't, and I would not be surprised to find that fewer than 5% not working primarily in LWR know anything about it. If I had not read about it in the paper, I wouldn't know about it, either. Typically, listing agents rely on sellers for info for the MLS and, if the seller provides the wrong info, the wrong info appears on the MLS (unless the agent knows for sure that the info is wrong, obviously.) Then, buyer agents rely on the MLS for that info, unless they know the info is wrong. It may not be perfect, but that's the way it works. Suggesting that agents are deliberately withholding this info just isn't right. Second, as I said, this issue took SMR by surprise. They believed they had the right to restrict access (as I understand it) but somewhere along the line, the interpretation changed. I believe it dates back to about 2002 or 2004 when the county commissioners began to rethink the understanding that SMR thought existed with regard to CDDs, gates, and 24 hour public access. My point is that expecting agents to be aware of every nuance of legal interpretation going on at any given point in time isn't realistic. Do they have the right to restrict or not? The law says that agents should not offer an opinion on matters beyond the scope of their knowledge. If SMR and and the county/state have had different opinions, it is clear that the answer to that question was beyond the scope of the agent. In other words, the correct answer to that question really should be to direct the buyer to refer to the association docs or contact the county.

    For those who don't know, there is an effort to privatize the roads.
  5. jmane

    jmane New Member

    Bob, I agree that most agents did or do not know about the public roads but our agent(s) lived in LWR and sold numerous homes here in 2000. Many years ago, I was a licensed agent elsewhere and the laws were on the side of the seller/buyer as the agent had a responsibility to disclose same. Has that changed?

    I have several questions about this site. Who is allowed to join -- general public or residents? Can our comments come back to bite us? Is it a good idea to have this on FB???? Are we able to delete our emails? And one question which keeps coming to mind is why is LWR so popular and will it be with all of the competition on the way?. Don't get me wrong -- I love it but there are some concerns. The mall is a great addition but it does bring in undesirables. Security is so important and there must be a way to improve on same.
  6. Bob Bronston

    Bob Bronston Founding Member

    I am not the owner or moderator of this site so I don't know exactly what they are doing about membership but I do believe we are supposed to state where we live in our profile, FWIW. Can comments posted online come back to bite you? I've seen news reports that would lead me to believe that they could but I post under my full name so I don't post anything I wouldn't say out loud so I don't worry about it. In the context of this thread, it is public info available to anyone who cares to find out so I don't think we are discussing anything that has the effect of "letting the cat out of the bag." In fact, I'd argue just the opposite. If someone living in the CC now has the mistaken belief that they have inherent security because of the gates, this thread may help them to see that they don't have as much as they thought (I believe there is still a value to the current situation), and they might want to take the appropriate steps to make their situation more secure if they feel it is needed for them. Forewarned really is forearmed.

    Regarding your agent in 2000, I wasn't an agent then but I can easily see how agents, even those living inside CC, would have believed that the roads were private or, at least, they had the ability to control access similar to places where the roads are private. After all, the best scenario for a buyer would be publicly maintained roads with strict access controls and that was the situation SMR seems to have thought they had designed with the county/state via the CDDs.
  7. Tom Willson

    Tom Willson New Member

    Yes, most of us were mislead about the public access aspect of our CCD community. Even Pat Neal cleverly disguised that problem by putting in Balmoral gate with "guards" included. I remember asking the Neal sales person why it was so easy for me to get through the gates as a visitor looking at houses. I came from a gated community and knew what is suppose to happen with the guards. Neal's rep said that this was just temporary during the construction phase when it was impractical to close things off due the large number of contractors and prospective buyers. Made sense, but was unfortunately untrue.

    Issuing transponders to our "trusted" vendors for quicker passage actually enhances security as follows:

    1. All of these vendors can get in anyway so it's not like we're opening the floodgates to a bunch of new vendors that couldn't get in before. Now when they come in through the visitor lane, the guards often do not collect the information that they are suppose to. Yes, we get a picture of their license plate at all gates, but that is not that useful unless there is a serious crime. Too hard to track down. And, if the guard does happen to record the license plate, name, vendor like they are suppose to, they often make a mistake when typing it in. With the transponder, it's like a tracking device so we know exactly who comes in, which vehicle and even how long they were here as long as they exit through one of transponder exits (in the future, we may have transponders on all exits). This is far more precise and reliable information than we have now. Also, THE TRANSPONDERS ARE DISABLED IF THE VENDOR ATTEMPTS TO REMOVE IT AND GIVE IT TO SOMEONE ELSE.

    2. We can limit the vendors access hours to anything that we want. 8:00am to 5:00 pm, Monday through Friday only, for example. We can also remotely disable their transponder at any time if they are no longer in good standing.

    3. When they apply for a transponder we can do more detailed screening right up front before we issue them one. For example, we can check to make sure they are even a legitimate vendor! The guards can't do that obviously, so they may log a vehicle and let them through and have no idea that they are just someone with an old panel truck posing as a legitimate vendor.

    4. Now that guards are generally doing a better job of screening visitors, you might notice that the Balmoral visitor lane backs up out onto LWR Blvd. fairly often in the morning. This is quite dangerous and is a lawsuit waiting to happen. Getting some of these vendors out of the visitor lane and quickly passing through the transponder lanes will help reduce these backups.

    This program is a bit analogous to TSA's airport PRE-PASS program where frequent travelers can skip the regular screening lanes. TSA figured out that it doesn't make sense to strip search some guy that flies on business 3 or 4 times a week. Why not do a more thorough job of a background check once, issue him a card, put him through an expedited lane and keep him out of the congested lanes where everyone else must be screened. Better for the frequent traveler, better for the masses who don't have him clogging up the regular screening lanes, better for TSA since it saves them labor, and it is more secure since they can do more background checks on the guy rather than just looking through his belongings. Win/win/win!
  8. SasaSara

    SasaSara Well-Known Member

    I have never heard of another gated community giving transponders to vendors because the gates back up. It sounds ludicrous to me. But then again I guess most gated communities aren't public roads. The biggest issue in my mind is the lack of communication from the board to the people of the CC. Surely something like this should have resident input?
  9. BillJacob

    BillJacob Well-Known Member

    I can't imagine any contractor paying $100 for a transponder. Bet the response is very poor. Sure it would be nice for them to get into the gate without waiting but it's not $100 nice. Seems like a poorly thought through idea to me....most of them just wait by a side gate and follow someone else in. That's free.

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